SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by Biff »

FredS wrote: 09 May 2022, 11:00 There's a meme of RGB with some pro abortion text making the rounds on my liberal friends FB pages. Someone commented that RBG should have been glad her mother didn't abort her. That drew an instant "Get the F off my page if you don't agree". Seriously, my liberal young woman friend told another friend (who I don't know) that she should leave if she doesn't agree with her.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

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tuttle wrote: 09 May 2022, 10:46
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 08:28
tuttle wrote: 09 May 2022, 06:28 Over the weekend there were protests at the actual homes of Kavanaugh and Roberts. Alito and his family have been moved to an undisclosed location. A church in Colorado was vandalized. A prolife office in Wisconsin was set on fire from a molotov cocktail.

Image
Extremism breeds violence. Extremism should be aborted. Too late for that, Alito is already born and breathing. Lol!
Is that like a joke for liberals or something?
Ah, no, it’s an attempt to point out that what is happening in practice is that it appears that the court is taking an “extreme” position that is opening the door to the most restrictive abortion laws. It is throwing open the doors to folks seeking to demonize those with whom they see as evil.

Here in OC California many Republicans are also livid. If Roberts had his way and Alito didn’t take the reigns as he appears to be doing, the Mississippi law might pass and remain while Roe would still essentially stand, more in line with most Americans. It would have made the most ardent activists on the far left angry anyway, but America would accept it more readily. Most Americans intrinsically seem to know the reality of abortion and value of life. It’s not merely a “liberal” thing. The ruling isn’t reflecting America. No real news there though. Everyone already knew that.

Liberals are complaining that the court isn’t upholding the traditions of upholding past rulings while Alito justifies his position by digging up legal traditions from the days of Cromwell. He even quoted Sir Matthew Hale! Yeah, this is really engendering faith in our courts! I’m not particularly favorable to any such traditions either way, but such is the way things are.

Of course, I may be even more radical in a centrist sort of way. I’m rather ambivalent toward Roe, somewhat at odds with the legal tradition of it. The whole terminology and basis is of legal assumptions ought to be tweaked IMO. But hey, I was happy to see fewer and fewer abortions taking place over the last many years. Why fix the least broken part (Roe)? There are much bigger fish to fry than for extremist to throw a monkey wrench into things!
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by Del »

Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 13:00
tuttle wrote: 09 May 2022, 10:46
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 08:28

Extremism breeds violence. Extremism should be aborted. Too late for that, Alito is already born and breathing. Lol!
Is that like a joke for liberals or something?
Ah, no, it’s an attempt to point out that what is happening in practice is that it appears that the court is taking an “extreme” position that is opening the door to the most restrictive abortion laws. It is throwing open the doors to folks like yourself seeking to demonize those with whom you see as evil.

Here in OC California many Republicans are also livid. If Roberts had his way and Alito didn’t take the reigns as he appears to be doing, the Mississippi law might pass and remain while Roe would still essentially stand, more in line with most Americans. It would have made the most ardent activists on the far left angry anyway, but America would accept it more readily. Most Americans intrinsically seem to know the reality of abortion and value of life. It’s not merely a “liberal” thing. The ruling isn’t reflecting America. No real news there though. Everyone already knew that.

Liberals are complaining that the court isn’t upholding the traditions of upholding past rulings while Alito justifies his position by digging up legal traditions from the days of Cromwell. He even quoted Sir Matthew Hale! Yeah, this is really engendering faith in our courts! I’m not particularly favorable to any such traditions either way, but such is the way things are.

Of course, I may be even more radical in a centrist sort of way. I’m rather ambivalent toward Roe, somewhat at odds with the legal tradition of it. The whole terminology and basis is of legal assumptions ought to be tweaked IMO. But hey, I was happy to see fewer and fewer abortions taking place over the last many years. Why fix the least broken part (Roe)? There are much bigger fish to fry than for extremist to throw a monkey wrench into things!
Roe was really bad jurisprudence, and doomed from the beginning. Blackmun said as much in the original opinion. Many pro-abortion jurists (such as RBG) have pointed this out.

For most of America, it is a good thing to let voters and legislators in each state decide for themselves how to regulate abortion in their own state.

For ardent pro-lifers, we want a new effort to see every child protected as a natural person by the 14th amendment.... equal protection under the law, so that life cannot be deprived without due process of law.

But we can't change laws until we change hearts, so we have been working diligently for decades to love mothers & children and to educate the culture. It is not a surprise that most of the country is not troubled by the end of Roe. Our antiquated open license for abortion is finally catching up to modern us.

Madison had a great turnout of pro-life families for a spontaneous march for life this Mother's Day. A small group of rowdy abortion enthusiasts tried to harass us. About half were young college kids, and the rest were geriatric feminist crones. They aren't focused; one young woman spent all of her time on the megaphone complaining about how the abortion lobby and LGBT rads don't spend enough attention on BIPOC people.

There was a lone terrorist (or perhaps small anarchist cell) who vandalized a small pro-family lobbying organization (that I had never heard of) with spray paint and a dud molotov. (Pro-life was just a small portion of what they do. There are much larger anti-abortion lobbies in Wisconsin.) Wisconsin Family Action has a small building, located far away from downtown, and that's why the cowards chose to attack it. There just aren't enough numbers of radical to stage a scene in the radical heart of Wisconsin.

If Madison is typical of Deep-Blue cities in purple states, it is clearly time for Roe to rest. Like the great many abortion clinics that have closed across America with much notice, this SCOTUS decision will not affect anyone but the abortion profiteers.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

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Probably just tin foil hat blathering; what if this is an intentional leak of fakery to find possible folks that would be prone to leak.

Some sort of ID number on the leaked doc that ties it back to a small audience possibly, just to smoke them out.

A sting of epic proportions.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by Del »

DLJake wrote: 09 May 2022, 15:36 Probably just tin foil hat blathering; what if this is an intentional leak of fakery to find possible folks that would be prone to leak.

Some sort of ID number on the leaked doc that ties it back to a small audience possibly, just to smoke them out.

A sting of epic proportions.
I wish they would do this inside of any of the various administrations that are prone to leakage.

But at the Supreme Court? The SCOTUS culture is tight and confidential.... there has never been a leak like this in America's history.]

And if this were a sting, we would know who the perp is by now.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by Del »

The latest rumor:

Report: Supreme Court Majority Still Supports Overturning Roe

The original report is at WaPo, which hides behind a paywall. This is an open report on Daily Wire.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

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WARNING THIS POST CONTAINS GRAPHIC IMAGES!
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 13:00
tuttle wrote: 09 May 2022, 10:46
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 08:28

Extremism breeds violence. Extremism should be aborted. Too late for that, Alito is already born and breathing. Lol!
Is that like a joke for liberals or something?
Ah, no, it’s an attempt to point out that what is happening in practice is that it appears that the court is taking an “extreme” position that is opening the door to the most restrictive abortion laws. It is throwing open the doors to folks seeking to demonize those with whom they see as evil.
THIS IS EVIL AND EXTREME:
ABORTION.png
ABORTION.png (786.53 KiB) Viewed 410 times
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 13:00Here in OC California many Republicans are also livid. If Roberts had his way and Alito didn’t take the reigns as he appears to be doing, the Mississippi law might pass and remain while Roe would still essentially stand, more in line with most Americans.
May 2022: A Fox News poll found Americans are pro-life on a 54-44% margin and majorities want abortions banned after either 6 weeks or 15 weeks.

January 2022: A Marist poll found 71% of Americans want aboritons to be made illegal or for more limits to be placed on them, all essentially supporting overturning Roe.

September 2021: A new Rasmussen poll shows Americans support the Texas abortion ban to save babies from abortion by a 46-43% margin.

June 2021: Gallup found 52% of Americans take a pro-life position on abortion wanting all (19%) or almost all 33% abortions made illegal.

Follow LifeNews on the MeWe social media network for the latest pro-life news free from Facebook’s censorship!

January 2021: A Marist Poll found a majority of Americans are pro-life and oppose all or virtually all abortions that take place in America today. When asked, 51% of Americans take a pro-life position with 12% of Americans say abortion should never be permitted under any circumstance, 11% of Americans say abortions should only be permitted to save the life of the mother and 28% of Americans take a pro-life position opposing 98% of abortions except in cases of rape or incest or if necessary to save the life of the mother.

December 2021: A Harvard-Harris poll found found 32% of Americans want to repeal Roe v. Wade entirely and another 24% of Americans believe the Supreme Court should uphold the Mississippi abortion ban at issue in the recent Supreme Court case, which bans abortions on unborn babies up to 15 weeks. That’ 56% of Americans who are for overturning completely or setting the abortion limit at 15 weeks, which can be done by overturning Roe.

July 2020: Gallup found 55% of Americans take a pro-life position on abortion wanting all (21%) or almost all 39% abortions made illegal.

June 2020: A CBS poll found just 43% of Americans think abortions should be generally available while 55% of Americans say it should either be more limited or should not be permitted altogether.

January 2020: Gallup found 58% of Americans oppose abortion on demand.

May 2019: A new Hill-HarrisX survey found that 55 percent of voters support laws banning abortions after six weeks – when an unborn baby’s heartbeat is detectable.

June 2019: A Morning Consult poll found 61% of Americans want all or almost all abortions made illegal.


Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 13:00Liberals are complaining that the court isn’t upholding the traditions of upholding past rulings while Alito justifies his position by digging up legal traditions from the days of Cromwell. He even quoted Sir Matthew Hale! Yeah, this is really engendering faith in our courts! I’m not particularly favorable to any such traditions either way, but such is the way things are.
Perhaps Cromwell & SIr Hale had more sense that today's 'liberals'.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by tuttle »

Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 13:00
tuttle wrote: 09 May 2022, 10:46
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 08:28

Extremism breeds violence. Extremism should be aborted. Too late for that, Alito is already born and breathing. Lol!
Is that like a joke for liberals or something?
Ah, no, it’s an attempt to point out that what is happening in practice is that it appears that the court is taking an “extreme” position that is opening the door to the most restrictive abortion laws. It is throwing open the doors to folks seeking to demonize those with whom they see as evil.

Here in OC California many Republicans are also livid. If Roberts had his way and Alito didn’t take the reigns as he appears to be doing, the Mississippi law might pass and remain while Roe would still essentially stand, more in line with most Americans. It would have made the most ardent activists on the far left angry anyway, but America would accept it more readily. Most Americans intrinsically seem to know the reality of abortion and value of life. It’s not merely a “liberal” thing. The ruling isn’t reflecting America. No real news there though. Everyone already knew that.

Liberals are complaining that the court isn’t upholding the traditions of upholding past rulings while Alito justifies his position by digging up legal traditions from the days of Cromwell. He even quoted Sir Matthew Hale! Yeah, this is really engendering faith in our courts! I’m not particularly favorable to any such traditions either way, but such is the way things are.

Of course, I may be even more radical in a centrist sort of way. I’m rather ambivalent toward Roe, somewhat at odds with the legal tradition of it. The whole terminology and basis is of legal assumptions ought to be tweaked IMO. But hey, I was happy to see fewer and fewer abortions taking place over the last many years. Why fix the least broken part (Roe)? There are much bigger fish to fry than for extremist to throw a monkey wrench into things!
"You shall not murder" isn't an extreme position to take. Maybe for citizens of clown world it is.

Those livid OC Republicans are sucky conservatives. They're probably just afraid they won't get an invite now to their gay friend's wedding or something.

As an aside, American legal traditions go far deeper than the days of Cromwell. We have laws against false charges that we can trace back to Hammu--friggin--rabi. At what point in the past do you suggest we sever our roots?

And maybe if America paid more heed to Sir Matthew Hale we'd have a few less witches hexing about.
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by Thunktank »

A majority of Americans have consistently wanted Roe to stand, myself included. Despite it’s imperfections, but it attempted to balance the rights of women and the interests society has in life and procreation. Ideally, both sides of this are important. A majority of Americans have wanted certain regulations and bans on certain abortions, myself included. Along with that, most Americans, myself included understand the suffering some women go through and know damn well that a bunch of politicians cannot be the primary decision maker from start to finish. Conservative libertarians should understand that pretty well. The only real question is when do legal rights begin for the pre born and what do they look like and what rights do women have.

Biff, show your graphic images. It’s low hanging fruit. I do not live in an idealized world and neither do you. Virtually no one believes abortion is glorious, neither do most people find joy in thinking that the meat on their dinner table was killed and gutted for their consumption. Some discomfort is a part of life. But I agree with you, late term, partial birth abortions shouldn’t be a regular part of this world, and fortunately it is the least common method to end a pregnancy.

I’ve seen my share of gore and guts. I’ve walked in on a gruesome murder scene once even. Cromwell know death too. Hanes had a low opinion of women and didn’t believe that rape could happen in a marriage. He also had a very high bar for rape in any case. Oh, and don’t forget the witch trials! More sense than liberals today? Naw, not even close. These men were straight up A holes that belong in the past.

I maintain that a woman has a right make one of the most important decisions
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SCOTUS Decision on Roe Leaked

Post by Thunktank »

tuttle wrote: 10 May 2022, 08:15
Thunktank wrote: 09 May 2022, 13:00
tuttle wrote: 09 May 2022, 10:46

Is that like a joke for liberals or something?
Ah, no, it’s an attempt to point out that what is happening in practice is that it appears that the court is taking an “extreme” position that is opening the door to the most restrictive abortion laws. It is throwing open the doors to folks seeking to demonize those with whom they see as evil.

Here in OC California many Republicans are also livid. If Roberts had his way and Alito didn’t take the reigns as he appears to be doing, the Mississippi law might pass and remain while Roe would still essentially stand, more in line with most Americans. It would have made the most ardent activists on the far left angry anyway, but America would accept it more readily. Most Americans intrinsically seem to know the reality of abortion and value of life. It’s not merely a “liberal” thing. The ruling isn’t reflecting America. No real news there though. Everyone already knew that.

Liberals are complaining that the court isn’t upholding the traditions of upholding past rulings while Alito justifies his position by digging up legal traditions from the days of Cromwell. He even quoted Sir Matthew Hale! Yeah, this is really engendering faith in our courts! I’m not particularly favorable to any such traditions either way, but such is the way things are.

Of course, I may be even more radical in a centrist sort of way. I’m rather ambivalent toward Roe, somewhat at odds with the legal tradition of it. The whole terminology and basis is of legal assumptions ought to be tweaked IMO. But hey, I was happy to see fewer and fewer abortions taking place over the last many years. Why fix the least broken part (Roe)? There are much bigger fish to fry than for extremist to throw a monkey wrench into things!
"You shall not murder" isn't an extreme position to take. Maybe for citizens of clown world it is.

Those livid OC Republicans are sucky conservatives. They're probably just afraid they won't get an invite now to their gay friend's wedding or something.

As an aside, American legal traditions go far deeper than the days of Cromwell. We have laws against false charges that we can trace back to Hammu--friggin--rabi. At what point in the past do you suggest we sever our roots?

And maybe if America paid more heed to Sir Matthew Hale we'd have a few less witches hexing about.
Not everyone, not even most believe all abortions (or even any abortions) are “murder”. That’s what you believe. So yeah, I understand how you come to your position, but you’re sharing a secular Democratic society with others with arguments against you.
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