The Holy Land Thread

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Wosbald
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Post by Wosbald »

+JMJ+
Del wrote: 11 Dec 2023, 10:14
Wosbald wrote: 11 Dec 2023, 08:10Source: America
Link: americamagazine DOT org/politics-society/2023/12/07/narrative-trauma-israel-palestine-war-246662

Why the Israel–Hamas war is so hard to talk about: identical narratives but different facts [Explainer]

〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰

Dec 7, 2023 — Since the Oct. 7 massacre of innocent civilians by Hamas and Israel’s subsequent declaration of war on Hamas, a fascinating dynamic has emerged: the Jewish and Palestinian narratives we see posted on social media have converged — with the protagonists and antagonists reversed.

[…]
This Jesuit double-speak is so embarrassing to read.

[…]
FWIW, it's written by Jews.

✡️
Cantor Olivia Brodsky and Rabbi Joshua Stanton are co-clergy at East End Temple in New York City.
:confusion-shrug:


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Post by Del »

Wosbald wrote: 11 Dec 2023, 11:24 +JMJ+
Del wrote: 11 Dec 2023, 10:14
Wosbald wrote: 11 Dec 2023, 08:10Source: America
Link: americamagazine DOT org/politics-society/2023/12/07/narrative-trauma-israel-palestine-war-246662


This Jesuit double-speak is so embarrassing to read.

[…]
FWIW, it's written by Jews.

✡️
Cantor Olivia Brodsky and Rabbi Joshua Stanton are co-clergy at East End Temple in New York City.
:confusion-shrug:
American coastal Jews can be just as stupid as white liberals.

I still note the remarkable foolishness of Jesuits for publishing this. Yes, the terrorist lies look a lot like rational truths -- reflected in a mirror.

Facts remain:
-- Israel does not desire the genocide of Palestinians. Hamas desires the genocide of Jews.
-- Israel would cooperate in a two-state solution, if that brings peace to what is left of the nations. Hamas will not tolerate Israel to exist.
-- Violent protests on US campuses and in US cities threaten the safety of Jews in America. No such threats exist against Palestinians or Muslims in general, but liars still claim that "Islamophobia" is a threat equal to or greater than anti-Semitism.
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The Holy Land Thread

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+JMJ+

Source: National Catholic Reporter
Link: ncronline DOT org/opinion/guest-voices/netanyahu-and-israeli-leadership-must-be-held-responsible-any-war-crimes
Netanyahu and Israeli leadership must be held responsible for any war crimes [Analysis, Opinion]

〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰

Dec 8, 2023 — War crimes around the globe abound. The International Criminal Court in The Hague, Netherlands, needs more resources to expose the perpetrators and bring them to justice. A partial listing of global crimes against humanity underscores the monumental tasks before human rights organizations and the court.

[…]

In Israel, the Oct. 7 terror attack by Hamas resulted in gruesome and ghastly atrocities. Hamas' house-to-house slaughter of families, defenseless children and even babies in their cribs and the brutal murders of parents dying while using their bodies to shield their children, demands a reckoning.

Leaders like Mohammed Diab Ibrahim A-Masri, also known as El Deif, and Yahya Sinawar, the head of Hamas in Gaza, should be held accountable for the bloodbath they perpetrated on the Israeli people. Like Russian President Vladimir Putin, they should be hunted and haunted for their barbarism and should not rest easy for the rest of their days.

For the past month, we have watched with horror Israel's response directed by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his civilian and military leadership. They have been relentlessly bombing Gaza, resulting in the deaths of more than 17,000 Gazans, including more than 7,000 children, according to Gaza authorities. Most of those killed were innocent of the atrocities of Hamas.

On Dec. 10, the world recognizes the 75th anniversary of the United Nations' adoption of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. It is vitally important for us to raise our voices over the possible war crimes that have been committed against innocent people. Under international law, they are entitled to protection from the violence of both Hamas and the Israeli government.

In Gaza today, Palestinians live in desperation for the essentials — water, food, shelter and medical care. Hunger and disease in Gaza are destroying families and neighborhoods. Hospitals have run out of supplies. Operations are done without anesthesia or pain relief. It is a hellish nightmare.

The Israeli bombing theory of "damage over accuracy" is the modus operandi of the Netanyahu government. Hence, the catastrophic civilian death toll in just one month. The Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) spokesman, Daniel Hagari, said on Oct. 10 that, at least during the initial invasion of Gaza, the emphasis of the IDF was "maximum damage."

The theory of "damage not accuracy" was employed when Hamas and Israel fought in Gaza in 2008–2009, a conflict that resulted in the deaths of about 1,400 Palestinians and Israelis. A 2009 United Nations report described the Israeli campaign as "a deliberately disproportionate attack designed to punish, humiliate, and terrorize a civilian population, radically diminish its local economic capacity both to work and to provide for itself, and to force upon it an ever-increasing sense of dependency and vulnerability."

A Washington Post columnist noted that in 2008 Gabriel Siboni, a former IDF colonel, "argued that the necessary response to militant provocations from Lebanon, Gaza, and Syria were disproportionate strikes that aim only secondarily to hit the enemy's capacity to launch rockets or other attacks. Rather, the goal should be to inflict lasting damage, no matter the civilian consequences, as a future deterrent."

Palestinian American scholar Rashid Khalidi said in 2014, "Let us be frank: this is actually less of a strategic doctrine than an explicit outline of collective punishment and probable war crimes."

Juliette Touma, director of communications for the United Nations Palestinian Refugee Agency, told NPR on Nov. 27 that 108 of her U.N. colleagues had been killed in Gaza since the war began.

The West Bank, where 3 million Palestinians reside, continues to be a land filled with tensions and acts of violence that threaten to break out into a broader and full-scale war. In the weeks since Oct. 7, Israeli settlers and troops have killed more than 200 West Bank Palestinians, according to the Reuters news agency.

That violence and threat of violence has displaced many West Bank Palestinians from their homes. Settlers' violence against the Palestinians has been increasing since settlers now have their own like-minded representatives in Netanyahu's cabinet.

It is way past time for Israel to cut its ties with Netanyahu. His legacy will be his failure to protect his own people, actions and policies toward the Palestinians that have stoked the hatred that now permeates the region, appointment of racist cabinet members, and his personal criminal activity that has brought shame on his family, party and country.

In addition to the possible war crimes committed by Hamas and their leaders, it is paramount that the International Criminal Court also hold Netanyahu and his cronies responsible for the thousands of lives that are being taken in their indiscriminate bombings in Gaza.

On Nov. 6, the organization Jewish Voice for Peace led a demonstration calling for a ceasefire and an end to U.S. funding of Israel's bombing of Gaza. A Facebook post from Jewish Voice for Peace described the event: "500 Jews and allies took over the Statue of Liberty, disrupting business as usual to demand a ceasefire in Gaza. We were joined by rabbis, electeds, celebrities, descendants of Holocaust survivors, and children."

In their own powerful and echoing words, "Never again means never again — for anyone."


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Post by Del »

Wosbald wrote: 12 Dec 2023, 13:24 +JMJ+

Source: National Catholic Reporter
Link: ncronline DOT org/opinion/guest-voices/netanyahu-and-israeli-leadership-must-be-held-responsible-any-war-crimes
Netanyahu and Israeli leadership must be held responsible for any war crimes [Analysis, Opinion]

〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰

For the past month, we have watched with horror Israel's response directed by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his civilian and military leadership. They have been relentlessly bombing Gaza, resulting in the deaths of more than 17,000 Gazans, including more than 7,000 children, according to Gaza authorities. Most of those killed were innocent of the atrocities of Hamas.
Serious request: If you want to post these kinds of stories, could you at least post reputable news sites? Real media who who quote reliable sources? And perhaps come to reasonable conclusions, at least some of the time?

It is a prosecutable war crime to use civilians as human shields. Hamas officials will have to answer for this, if they survive to be prosecuted.

Meanwhile, we know that Hamas is greatly inflating the number of civilian casualties that they have caused -- blocking evacuation routes with guns to prevent civilians from fleeing. Recently, a viral video showed thousands of Palestinians evacuating through a corridor opened by IDF for the safe travel of Palestinian civilians.

I'm not sure who NCR is carrying water for.... even Democrats in Washington are condemning the war crimes and atrocities committed by Hamas (well, all except for those few famously anti-Semitic bigots).

There are plenty of anti-Semites among the left-wing intelligentsia. Some of them must have control of National Catholic Reporter's editorial board. Easier than securing a post as president of an Ivy League college.
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Post by Del »

I saw a longer version of this clip in a podcast. Hamas are very, very proud of their threats of future terrorism, including sending young boys and girls on suicide missions.

Civilized Muslims are deeply scandalized by this, by the way.

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Post by Del »

I think I just figured out the connection linking National Catholic Reporter's blindly one-sided, anti-Semitic reporting on Hamas's genocidal hatred of Jews.

‘Queers For Palestine’ Protesters Shut Down Manhattan Bridge

Even though Hamas terrorists would throw any LGBT activists off of the nearest building or cliff in Palestine, LGBT activists in America hate Jews more (and America's support of Israel, and America in general).

And NCR is a very warm toward LGBT ideology, in defiance of Catholic teaching. So they fall into the hole.
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Hamas gunmen surround UNRWA food trucks and steal the supplies, firing upon hungry civilian Palestinians.

Hamas Gunmen Target Palestinian Civilians — From The Top Of Aid Trucks





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Post by sweetandsour »

Very difficult stuff to watch. And it all really makes one think "what the hell?". Prayers for the believers that are scattered amongst all of the other people in the Gaza and elsewhere there.
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Post by Del »

IDF Begins Flooding Hamas Terror Tunnels With Seawater

The goal is to defeat Hamas by flushing them out of their fortified positions and secure hiding places. But this also serves the goal of saving the lives of Palestinian civilians, as Hamas will no longer be hiding under schools, hospitals, apartments, and mosques.

There may be long-term damage. The salt water may contaminate wells and soil, and undermine the foundations of buildings. Swaths of Gaza may be rendered unlivable, perhaps for decades. We don't know for sure. Israel did their best to evaluate these risks, but obviously no opportunity for a proper engineering evaluation.

For now, this is an effort to save Palestinian lives while depriving Hamas of their military assets. It will take a few weeks to flood all of the tunnels.
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Post by Wosbald »

+JMJ+
Del wrote: 12 Dec 2023, 15:12[…]

It is a prosecutable war crime to use civilians as human shields. Hamas officials will have to answer for this, if they survive to be prosecuted.

Meanwhile, we know that Hamas is greatly inflating the number of civilian casualties that they have caused …
"Using Human Shields" would only make Hamas responsible for yet-another war crime. It wouldn't absolve Israel of "Firing on Human Shields".

At this rate, they're gonna hafta clear-the-docket at The Hague.

🏛️⚖️


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