The Pope Francis Thread

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The Pope Francis Thread

Post by Del »

Wosbald wrote: 18 May 2023, 17:16 +JMJ+

Source: Crux
Link: cruxnow DOT com/vatican/2023/05/vatican-stamp-inspired-by-monument-celebrating-colonial-era-stirs-controversy
--> --> Link to Stamp Pic: wp.cruxnow DOT com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/WYD-stamp.jpg
Vatican stamp inspired by monument celebrating colonial era stirs controversy
Colonialism was a great thing. None of us would be here without it. The native peoples of Central America would still live in terror of being sacrificed to the Aztec gods. The descendants of African slaves would still be slaves in Africa.

I hope Pope Francis ignores the whiners, as I do.
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The Pope Francis Thread

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Apparently, one the Pope's boys opened fire on an undocumented migrant at the Vatican
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news ... in-custody

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The Pope Francis Thread

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Hovannes wrote: 23 May 2023, 19:26 Apparently, one the Pope's boys opened fire on an undocumented migrant at the Vatican
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news ... in-custody
An unidentified man is in custody after driving a car at high speed through a gate at the Vatican Thursday, the Holy See press office said.

A guard stationed at the Santa Anna entrance fired his weapon in the direction of the vehicle’s front tires, hitting the left front fender, but the vehicle proceeded onto the Vatican grounds until the driver got out at the San Damaso Courtyard, the main courtyard of the Apostolic Palace, the press office said. There the man was blocked and placed under arrest by the Gendarmerie Corps, the press office said.
Shot for the tires. Not really enough to kill the vehicle or harm the driver, but enough to scare the bejesus out of the perp and any innocent bystanders.

I don't know that the perp was an undocumented immigrant. News articles are all reporting that he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State. And that he was found to be in "a serious state of psychophysical alteration." (Translation: He sobered up in jail.)

In a world full of crazy people who hate the Catholic Church with fierce bigotry, it is a wonder that this sort of thing does not happen more often.
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The Pope Francis Thread

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Del wrote: 24 May 2023, 06:03
Hovannes wrote: 23 May 2023, 19:26 Apparently, one the Pope's boys opened fire on an undocumented migrant at the Vatican
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news ... in-custody
An unidentified man is in custody after driving a car at high speed through a gate at the Vatican Thursday, the Holy See press office said.

A guard stationed at the Santa Anna entrance fired his weapon in the direction of the vehicle’s front tires, hitting the left front fender, but the vehicle proceeded onto the Vatican grounds until the driver got out at the San Damaso Courtyard, the main courtyard of the Apostolic Palace, the press office said. There the man was blocked and placed under arrest by the Gendarmerie Corps, the press office said.
Shot for the tires. Not really enough to kill the vehicle or harm the driver, but enough to scare the bejesus out of the perp and any innocent bystanders.

I don't know that the perp was an undocumented immigrant. News articles are all reporting that he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State. And that he was found to be in "a serious state of psychophysical alteration." (Translation: He sobered up in jail.)

In a world full of crazy people who hate the Catholic Church with fierce bigotry, it is a wonder that this sort of thing does not happen more often.
The perp wasn't a citizen of the Vatican City, which is a sovereign nation. He was charging the border, which is what migrants seem to be doing all the time here and in other countries. Did he have a nefarious plan? We don't know.
"...he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State..." Ss no proper documentation.
According to the security guard, that's enough to take him into custody or even employ deadly force.
Maybe he was after political asylum?
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The Pope Francis Thread

Post by Del »

Hovannes wrote: 24 May 2023, 06:22
Del wrote: 24 May 2023, 06:03
Hovannes wrote: 23 May 2023, 19:26 Apparently, one the Pope's boys opened fire on an undocumented migrant at the Vatican
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news ... in-custody
An unidentified man is in custody after driving a car at high speed through a gate at the Vatican Thursday, the Holy See press office said.

A guard stationed at the Santa Anna entrance fired his weapon in the direction of the vehicle’s front tires, hitting the left front fender, but the vehicle proceeded onto the Vatican grounds until the driver got out at the San Damaso Courtyard, the main courtyard of the Apostolic Palace, the press office said. There the man was blocked and placed under arrest by the Gendarmerie Corps, the press office said.
Shot for the tires. Not really enough to kill the vehicle or harm the driver, but enough to scare the bejesus out of the perp and any innocent bystanders.

I don't know that the perp was an undocumented immigrant. News articles are all reporting that he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State. And that he was found to be in "a serious state of psychophysical alteration." (Translation: He sobered up in jail.)

In a world full of crazy people who hate the Catholic Church with fierce bigotry, it is a wonder that this sort of thing does not happen more often.
The perp wasn't a citizen of the Vatican City, which is a sovereign nation. He was charging the border, which is what migrants seem to be doing all the time here and in other countries. Did he have a nefarious plan? We don't know.
"...he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State..." Ss no proper documentation.
According to the security guard, that's enough to take him into custody or even employ deadly force.
Maybe he was after political asylum?
Oookaaay.... I see the joke now.

I have crossed the borders of the Vatican (as a pilgrim), undocumented but not unwelcome.

On the other hand, I didn't charge any gates or defy the guards protecting the business/government portion of the Vatican. Which means I didn't get to see the Cistine Chapel, which was full up with cardinals during Poping Season.
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Ukraine

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+JMJ+

Source: Crux
Link: cruxnow DOT com/church-in-europe/2023/05/popes-handpicked-mediator-on-ukraine-defends-franciss-line-on-the-war
Pope’s handpicked mediator on Ukraine defends Francis’s line on the war

〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰〰

ROME — In a potential glimpse of things to come, Italian Cardinal Matteo Zuppi, tasked with leading Pope Francis’s peace mission in Ukraine, on Tuesday called war a “pandemic” and defended the pope’s handling of the Ukraine–Russia war.

In a keynote address at the beginning of the spring plenary assembly for the Italian Bishops’ Conference (CEI), Zuppi, the conference president, began his lengthy and wide-ranging speech with an appeal for peace, specifically in Ukraine.

Quoting Pope Francis, he said it is a country with “a martyred people.”

Despite criticism that Francis has been too soft in his treatment of Russia over its invasion of Ukraine — including refusing for months after the conflict began to even say the word “Russia” or to mention its President, Vladimir Putin — Zuppi voiced gratitude for the pope’s “prophecy” on the war.

Such a position, he said, is “so rare today, when speaking of peace seems to avoid taking sides or acknowledging responsibility.”

The pope’s voice, “takes charge of the deep anxiety, sometimes unexpressed, often unheard, of the peoples who need peace,” he said, saying, “War is a pandemic. It involves us all.”

CEI’s spring general assembly is taking place May 22–25, with the theme, “Listening to what the Spirit tells the Churches: Steps Toward Discernment.”

[…]

In his speech Tuesday, Zuppi invoked Pope Francis’s chastisement of European leaders in his speech to national authorities and the diplomatic corps in Hungary April 28, asking, “Where are creative efforts for peace?”

Francis in that speech pointed to what he said was a deterioration of international relations, and Zuppi repeated this lamentation, saying, “We seem to be witnessing the sorry sunset of that choral dream of peace, as the soloists of war now take over.”

“More and more, enthusiasm for building a peaceful and stable community of nations seems to be cooling, as zones of influence are marked out, differences accentuated, nationalism is on the rise,” he said.

At the international level, “it even seems that politics serves more to stir up emotions rather than to resolve problems, as the maturity attained after the horrors of the war gives way to regression towards a kind of adolescent belligerence,” he said, saying peace will never be achieved “as the result of the pursuit of individual strategic interests, but only from policies capable of looking to the bigger picture.”

Zuppi said the pope’s analysis is one that “questions us,” saying that for Christians, “peace is not just a wish, but it is the very reality of the Church, which germinates, like a seed, from the Eucharist and the Gospel.”

Both the Church itself and individual Christians not only believe in peace, but “we are all called to be peacemakers, even more so in the terrible storm of conflicts,” Zuppi said, noting that the church “was among the people and on the ground” during the Second World War.

He noted that in just a few days’ time, on June 3, the Church will mark the 60th anniversary of the death of St. Pope John XXIII, who lived through two world wars “and effectively updated the peaceful message of faith” with his famed 1963 encyclical Pacem in Terris, meaning “Peace on Earth,” which outlined the rights and obligations of people and their states, as well as his vision for proper interstate relations.

“We are the people of peace, starting with Jesus, who is our peace,” Zuppi said, noting that Italy given its location in the Mediterranean is “a hinge between North and South, but also between East and West.”

[…]

Zuppi lamented that there is often an attitude of “indifference” to global conflicts in which many remain “spectators of war reduced to a game.”

Actions of peace are needed to overcome this indifference, he said, saying solidarity with refugees, those from Ukraine and beyond, is a starting point, as there are many conflicts around the world raging, prompting people to flee their homes in search of safety elsewhere.

“In a world like ours we cannot do without a global vision,” he said, saying, “following the painful events of distant countries, with prayer and information, is a form of charity. After all, the culture of peace is a decisive chapter of the culture of life, which draws inspiration from faith.”

Faith must become part of culture Zuppi said, saying the world is in “an emotional and subjective time” in which deculturation is being pushed while “everything becomes fluid, even that which yesterday would have been unthinkable.”

“There is a great risk of being reduced to intimism, welfarism, or simply living outside history,” he said.

[…]


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The Pope Francis Thread

Post by Hovannes »

Del wrote: 24 May 2023, 09:46
Hovannes wrote: 24 May 2023, 06:22
Del wrote: 24 May 2023, 06:03



Shot for the tires. Not really enough to kill the vehicle or harm the driver, but enough to scare the bejesus out of the perp and any innocent bystanders.

I don't know that the perp was an undocumented immigrant. News articles are all reporting that he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State. And that he was found to be in "a serious state of psychophysical alteration." (Translation: He sobered up in jail.)

In a world full of crazy people who hate the Catholic Church with fierce bigotry, it is a wonder that this sort of thing does not happen more often.
The perp wasn't a citizen of the Vatican City, which is a sovereign nation. He was charging the border, which is what migrants seem to be doing all the time here and in other countries. Did he have a nefarious plan? We don't know.
"...he didn't have permissions to enter the business quarters of Vatican State..." Ss no proper documentation.
According to the security guard, that's enough to take him into custody or even employ deadly force.
Maybe he was after political asylum?
Oookaaay.... I see the joke now.

I have crossed the borders of the Vatican (as a pilgrim), undocumented but not unwelcome.

On the other hand, I didn't charge any gates or defy the guards protecting the business/government portion of the Vatican. Which means I didn't get to see the Cistine Chapel, which was full up with cardinals during Poping Season.
I'm sorry to hear that, Del. The Sistine Chapel is truly an amazing experience.
Pilgrims to the Vatican arrive as pilgrims. They don't break laws, like charging gates, climbing walls or sneaking past Swiss Guards to get in.
Pilgrims don't engage in human trafficking (well perhaps the purple mafia does, but they aren't exactly pilgrims) or fentanyl dealing.
There's the hypocrisy.
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The Pope Francis Thread

Post by Del »

Hovannes wrote: 24 May 2023, 20:19 Pilgrims don't engage in human trafficking (well perhaps the purple mafia does, but they aren't exactly pilgrims) or fentanyl dealing.
There's the hypocrisy.
None shall disparage the nobility of purple. Not on my watch!

Speak of the Lavender Mafia.
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The Pope Francis Thread

Post by Hovannes »

Del wrote: 25 May 2023, 06:22
Hovannes wrote: 24 May 2023, 20:19 Pilgrims don't engage in human trafficking (well perhaps the purple mafia does, but they aren't exactly pilgrims) or fentanyl dealing.
There's the hypocrisy.
None shall disparage the nobility of purple. Not on my watch!

Speak of the Lavender Mafia.
Gotcha!
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The Pope Francis Thread

Post by Hovannes »

I feel bad criticizing Francis in the above posts.
He's an old man and he's doing his best.
The weight of the papacy must be very heavy on him.
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